[AmauryJVL]

Can i add premium gas to my escape and would that make any difference??

 

[Airmapper]

I may have to be corrected, but as I recall you can put it in there, but it won't make a difference.

I put some in by accident and noticed no change whatsoever, and I was tracking the fuel consumption at the time.

 

[ltlredscape]

No it wont, unless you get an Xcal3, then you can tune the PCM to properly take advantage of the premium fuel...and have fun!
Tuning aside, the escape has a rather low compression ratio and thus can only run efficiently on regular or midgrade gas. Premium fuel in it will decrease MPG too because high octane fuel is harder to ignite and burns slower and that is why it requires high compression to burn it efficiently, also it leads to carbon build-up in the engine and other places. Pinging/detonation in these cars arnt a problem because of the engine's knock sensors. In very simplified terms, when they detect pinging, the computer lessons the spark to compensate.
If the Escape's engine had a carb, which it dosent thankfully, then its a whole other story.

 

[etrailer]

Without adjusting the spark tables, read custom tuning, you won't be able to take advantage of the higher octane rating.

 

[LEO_Escape]

Just to reiterate, yes you can add it. The only difference it will make is your wallet will be a few bucks lighter each time. Just like they said, in stock form, the Escape is not tuned for premium.

 

[jonas1022]

Best performance (ie, power output) will be acheived by using the lowest possible fuel rating without pinging. The higher the octane the harder it is to make it combust. Hence, no pinging. Ping is to pre-ignite the fuel before the appropriate time. Higher mileage will be achieved by using a lower octane rated gas. Sort of a win-win.

 

[slavrenz]

+1 on all accounts above. The minimum acceptable octance is 87, so use that.

 

[SUVord]

For automobile engines equipped with a knock sensor one may take advantage of using higher octane gasoline, (petrol), if more power is to be achieved.That is because the sensor will not decrease the ignition timing too much.And within some limits, the higher the ignition timing the more power, at a cost, you get from your automobile.
As for sensing the benefits of using higher octane fuel you have to be patient for at least a couple of tank fulls until the whole system is accustomed to it.
One more benefit of the higher octane fuel is that it is more free of unwanted and energy wasting residues like the ones you find in regular gasoline.
A properly working knock sensor is starting to operate at the highest possible ignition timing sending command mode and then it starts decreasing the timing to compensate for the gas used.
One may easily verify that, with the appropriate cost involved, if he or she takes the car for a dyno test with a certain fuel and after two or three tankfuls the same dyno is used for the measurements.

 

[slavrenz]

For automobile engines equipped with a knock sensor one may take advantage of using higher octane gasoline, (petrol), if more power is to be achieved.That is because the sensor will not decrease the ignition timing too much.And within some limits, the higher the ignition timing the more power, at a cost, you get from your automobile.
As for sensing the benefits of using higher octane fuel you have to be patient for at least a couple of tank fulls until the whole system is accustomed to it.
One more benefit of the higher octane fuel is that it is more free of unwanted and energy wasting residues like the ones you find in regular gasoline.
A properly working knock sensor is starting to operate at the highest possible ignition timing sending command mode and then it starts decreasing the timing to compensate for the gas used.
One may easily verify that, with the appropriate cost involved, if he or she takes the car for a dyno test with a certain fuel and after two or three tankfuls the same dyno is used for the measurements.

I'm afraid that this is incorrect. Using higher octane fuel above the minimum recommended will not increase your power - your engine has a fixed compression ratio, and it would need a higher compression ratio to take advantage of the power increase of higher octane fuel. The knock sensor will not let you take advantage of higher octane fuel, either, unless you are already using octane below the recommended minimum, or you have some other problem with your engine.

The knock sensor is basically a microphone, and when it hears pinging, it [email protected] the ignition timing, which prevents detonation, and actually reduces power significantly. If your engine is in good working order, and you use the minimum recommended octane, you won't have any pinging. Therefore, putting higher octane gas in your car will not have any effect on the knock sensor, since there was no pinging in the first place. Even if the knock sensor did have a response, it would never be to advance the ignition timing. It always [email protected] timing, which always results in decreased power.

I am having a little trouble understanding some of your English, but the only way to take advantage of higher octane fuel is with a completely revamped air/fuel program in your ECU. Even then, this will not give you nearly as much additional power as having an engine with a physically higher compression ratio, but the only way a knock sensor would ever give you more power is if you have some severe engine problem that you are masking by [email protected] the ignition timing to the point that the engine runs smoothly.

If you have dyno tests that show a properly tuned car with a stock ECU getting significant power gains from higher octane fuel, I'd love to see them.

Here is a good basic article about how octane work: http://www.oregon.gov/ODA/MSD/docs/pdf/ ... e.pdf?ga=t

 

[SUVord]

I carefully read the information in that site and I found nothing to dissagree with.What I found were some omissions and mix-ups though.
The octane rating method mentioned is not universal.The European method, for example, uses just the RON figure while the USA method uses the formula (MON+RON)/2.That is why there is a descrepancy when comparing American with European octane numbers.The European octane number is higher by four units compared to the American equivalent.
Also in that instructive bulletin one will get the misconception that the higher the compression ratio the higher octane fuel is needed..True, indeed, in most cases and certrainly way off the truth with turbo engines where the compression ratio is much lower than the one you find in non-turbo engines but the fuel required is of the premium function and quality!
Also, I read, too, that by changing to a higher octane fuel you will probably get more power which you may also get by doing a tune-up.Very true.
Another omission, seeking clarification, in that buletin is the explanation of how the knock sensor works, since it is a component found in most engines today.
The bottom line is that I never recomend changing to a higher octane fuel unless one wishes to spend pretty good bucks for a minimal gain.
Now that you have me going I might experiment and put some dielectric compound in the tank and see how many horses I get!
A very Happy Holidays to all those getting their hands dirty...and all the others too!!!

 

[slavrenz]

I carefully read the information in that site and I found nothing to dissagree with.What I found were some omissions and mix-ups though.
The octane rating method mentioned is not universal.The European method, for example, uses just the RON figure while the USA method uses the formula (MON+RON)/2.That is why there is a descrepancy when comparing American with European octane numbers.The European octane number is higher by four units compared to the American equivalent.
Also in that instructive bulletin one will get the misconception that the higher the compression ratio the higher octane fuel is needed..True, indeed, in most cases and certrainly way off the truth with turbo engines where the compression ratio is much lower than the one you find in non-turbo engines but the fuel required is of the premium function and quality!
Also, I read, too, that by changing to a higher octane fuel you will probably get more power which you may also get by doing a tune-up.Very true.
Another omission, seeking clarification, in that buletin is the explanation of how the knock sensor works, since it is a component found in most engines today.
The bottom line is that I never recomend changing to a higher octane fuel unless one wishes to spend pretty good bucks for a minimal gain.
Now that you have me going I might experiment and put some dielectric compound in the tank and see how many horses I get!
A very Happy Holidays to all those getting their hands dirty...and all the others too!!!

Good lord, it looks as if I've developed a reputation on here already :lol:

 

[SUVord]

As long as the reputation is a good one you have nothing to be afraid off.
Cheers everyone :beer:

 

[Billyk]

Fill up with 20% ethanol --around 3 gallons of E85--and you have 91 octane, reduced greenhouse gas emission and saved money at the pump due to the cheaper price of E85. The 09 and newer vehicles have a wide band oxygen sensor which runs even more efficient on this blend. I do this all the time--over three years now--and need a blend of greater than 55% ethanol to obtain a check engine light due a lean condition in my 05 Hybrid.

 

[SUVord]

Fill up with 20% ethanol --around 3 gallons of E85--and you have 91 octane, reduced greenhouse gas emission and saved money at the pump due to the cheaper price of E85. The 09 and newer vehicles have a wide band oxygen sensor which runs even more efficient on this blend. I do this all the time--over three years now--and need a blend of greater than 55% ethanol to obtain a check engine light due a lean condition in my 05 Hybrid.

Just out of curiosity.What is the compression ratio of the hybrid Escape so that it can safely burn such a high percentage of ethanol in the fuel?The lamda sensor is the compensator for limiting emissions while the compression ratio and the timing devices are the primary means of achieving and maintaining power when used with the right fuel.
Ethanol has a much higher octane rating but way too low energy compared to pure gasoline.
If power is the objective one must stay away from ethanol.If economy is the goal, then...

 

[Billyk]

This link: http://domesticfuel.com/category/indy-racing-league/ reveals ethanol is being using in the 2012 race series. So much for a loss of power with ethanol.

The Hybrid has a stated 12.3 to 1 compression ratio secondary to the non-Otto based ICE.

The BTU content is all 3.3% less on E10, that would be 6.6% less on E20, 9.9% less on E30. How can this be "way too low" to be driven? Heck, I seen police vehicles using the (E20) fuel. The electronic fuel injection system found on modern designed engines has automatic adjustability to its fuel supply. This means the oxygen sensor detects oxygen (ethanol by-product) in the exhaust and richens the fuel system-it tells the engine computer (ECM) the fuel system is too lean, and then the fuel supply is increased. This can increase fuel consumption and increase power. The increased fuel consumption (lowered MPG) is what "hypermilers of hybrid vehicles" bitch about and do not want ethanol blending of fuel. The same automatic adjustability can also work to gradually lean out excess fuel. This what I have experienced:

 

[SUVord]

Thank you very much for your prompt reply.
In it you do consent what is scientifically proven that a normal gasoline offers more BTU than ethanol.
Also, racing engines are not the best to compare with.The reason is that their design is focused in outright performance with a very very small life expectancy.Additionally, all manufacturers in the racing circuit enjoy some regulations benefits if they switch to a different fuel than the norm.
I see no ground for arguing with you.Absolutely none.
It is my engineering philosophical approach toward simple easy and straight solutions which is to blame when it comes to my dissatisfaction of sacrificing power...
As long as the owner is happy with what he or she drives the engineers and the marketeers can be happy too.

Merry Christmas.

PS.:I am curious whether you have tried premium octane fuel for a while and what you think of it, besides beeing much more expensive.

 

[Billyk]

Merry Christmas. I got to go. I have no interest in using Premium gasoline.

 

[jonas1022]

Just for grins and giggles I did use three or four tankfuls of Premium unleaded gas back in 06 when I first bought my 01 Mustang Bullitt. It averaged out to just over 21 mpg over the time that I used it. I have been using Regular Unleaded gas ever since, and the average fuel mileage has gone from a low of 22 up to over 27 mpg this past summer.

I concluded that the use of Premium fuel in my car is counter productive. Either way I have no pinging, no issues with any fuel except whenever I get on the loud pedal :woohoo: . That does make the gas go away more rapidly. :lol:

 

[SUVord]

This thread was started by AmauryJVL asking whether using premium gasoline would make any difference.The simple answer to that question is yes! Premium gasoline will make a difference in power output in many cases when the driving gets harder and harder, the engine gets warmer and warmer and the knock sensor will and should lower the ignition timing to prevent pinging.That decrease in the timing advance alone means less power.By using higher octane gasoline the timing advance decrease will be less,thus less loss of power.
It is not to be misunderstood that one has to use premium gasoline for more power.It is only at a critical point when power will be reduced because of using regular gasoline, that premium gasoline helps.
As for ethanol etc there is too much politics and lobbying involved, which in itself would invite a heated debate.Besides octanes and additives etc,...
...I was fortunate enough some years ago to get hold of some gallons of the the FIA regulated fuel for the WRC paying $18 per gallon!!!The fuel was rated at 100 RON or 96octane in the USA.
It was enough for two tank-fullsand by the second tankful my Maverick was ready to fly.The reason was that this fuel is highly inspected and regulated for purity without any useless contaminants in it.
Ifone is happy and satisfied with the fuel he or she uses fine.
But this thread was not starded and never intended to be a "contest" between regular and premium gasoline.